Winstrol tabs van prodigy

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  • #46
    Taken from BlackSheep @ Elite)

    Interesting Read on 17aa's and The Liver

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    From an athletic standpoint, certain types of anabolic steroids are frequently mentioned as having bad effects on liver function. Theyre usually oral drugs that are classified as 17-alpha ankylated drugs.

    The designation 17-alpha ankylated refers to a change made on position 17 of the basic steroid structure. Scientists developed the testosterone derivatives after noticing that orally taken testosterone is degraded in the liver in a process called first-pass metabolism. Drug developers circumvented that formidable problem by making testosterone available in an injectable form, which bypasses initial first-pass liver metabolism, and by manipulating the basic steroid chemical structure, as is the case with oral 17-alpha ankylated anabolic steroids.

    While the structural change in oral anabolic steroids did result in a far slower rate of breakdown in the liver, it also led to an inordinate buildup of such drugs in the liver. Since the injectable versions of steroids dont build up in the liver as much as oral versions, the injectables are considered less of a problem in terms of normal liver function.

    The oral drugs adversely affect the liver through several mechanisms. For example, they interfere with the function of certain liver enzymes. Anabolic steroids are known to increase the activity of some liver enzymes while downgrading that of others. One enzyme thats increased with oral anabolic steroid use is hepatic triglyceride lipase, which degrades high-density lipoprotein (HDL), a beneficial cholesterol carrier in the blood. A lowered HDL level is considered a risk factor for cardiovascular disease. Athletes who use oral anabolic steroids nearly always show depressed HDL levels. The buildup of 17-alpha ankylated oral anabolic steroids in the liver leads to a type of toxic or chemical hepatitis. Hepatitis, by the way, is a general word for an inflammation of the liver and can be caused by various factors, such as drug use and viruses. Oral steroids cause liver inflammation by promoting an increase in the size of liver cells, which leads to a congestion of bile flow through ducts in the liver that empty into the gallbladder, where bile is stored.

    The interference with bile flow induced by the effects of anabolic steroids on liver cells is called cholestasis. It usually occurs only in people who use higher doses of oral steroids or who use such steroids for extended periods of time. Certain oral steroids are reputed to have more potent toxic effect in the liver and to promote the liver swelling that can lead to cholestasis. They include oxymetholone (Anadrol-50) and fluoxymesterone (Halotestin), although it may be that those drugs cause problems because theyre often used in higher doses than other oral steroids. Both drugs are 17-alpha ankylated, as are most oral steroids.

    According to existing medical research, most cases of serious liver ailments due to oral anabolic steroid use have involved hospitalized patients who were given oral steroids such as Anadrol-50 to combat rare blood anemias. Many stayed on oral steroids for three or more years. The consensus of medical reviews is that certain potentially adverse liver changes do occur with athletic usewith the extent of the changes again depending on the drugs used, the doses and the length of timebut the changes regress when the athletes stop using the steroids. The liver is known to have an amazing capacity for regeneration unless its irrevocably damaged, a scenario that rarely occurs with short-term steroid use.

    Physicians often warn about elevated liver enzyme levels due to oral anabolic steroid use. While that could indicate an inflammation of the liver, the problem is that some of the measured liver enzymes arent specific to the liver and exist in other tissues. For example, two enzymes found in liver, ALT and AST, also exist in muscle. Any type of injury to muscleincluding the kind that occurs with intense weight trainingcauses an elevation of those enzymes in the blood. A physician whos not looking at the big pictureor measuring levels of other liver and muscle enzymesmay wrongly conclude that such liver enzyme increases are indicative of liver problems.1 Measuring enzymes such as creatine kinase and GGT would provide a more definitive picture of existing liver function, as would liver imaging tests.

    One visible early sign of liver inflammation due to oral steroid use is jaundice, which is characterized by a retention of bile in the body, leading to a yellow discoloration in the skin and whites of the eyes. Anyone using oral anabolic steroids should stop using them immediately if such symptoms occur. If you ignore the symptoms, youre at risk for a more serious liver complication.

    Peliosis hepatis, as its called, consists of blood-filled cysts in the liver. Its thought to be due to cholestasis; that is, the elevated pressure in liver tissue brought about by lack of proper bile flow in the liver leads to a breakdown of liver cells followed by the appearance of the cysts. The blood-filled cysts can rupture, leading to death. Most cases of peliosis have occurred in hospitalized patients on long-term steroid therapy, although the occurrence of peliosis isnt dependent on dosage.

    One published instance of peliosis involved a 27-year-old bodybuilder who was using a steroid stack consisting of oxandrolone (Anavar), methandrostenolone (Dianabol), nandrolone (Durabolin) and testosterone for five weeks.2 What he took before that time wasnt disclosed in the published report. The interesting aspect is that the drug stack he used isnt considered highly toxic to the liver. The bodybuilder may have used more toxic oral steroids over a longer period, however, or he may have taken a drug such as Nolvadex, an estrogen blocker that few bodybuilders know can also cause peliosis if used in too high a dose for too long.

    The other serious liver disease often linked to oral anabolic steroid use is liver cancer. Reviews of liver cancer in various medical journals indicate that its of a more benign nature than other cancers. Simply put, the liver tumors that develop with steroid use usually regress if the person stops using the drugs. Thats not always the case, however.

    A few published accounts document liver cancer fatalities among athletes who have used oral anabolic steroids. In most cases, though, the athletes stayed on the drugs for extended periods. For example, one 26-year-old bodybuilder used a steroid stack consisting of Dianabol, Anavar, Winstrol, Deca-Durabolin and Primobolan for four years before being diagnosed with liver cancer.3 He refused chemotherapy to treat his cancerprobably because it had progressed to a fatal stageand died.

    Another bodybuilder who succumbed to liver cancer took Anadrol-50 for five consecutive years,4 and a 27-year-old Indian bodybuilder died after a liver tumor allegedly induced by his anabolic steroid use ruptured.5 The report documenting that case failed to list his specific steroid regimen. The most recent case of a bodybuilder who had apparent steroid-induced liver cancer involved a 31-year-old man.6 His cancer was considered benign and had not spread or metastasized; however, his liver tumors didnt decrease in size even after hed been off steroids for 18 months.

    Several options have been suggested as methods of protecting the liver from steroid-induced damage. One obvious technique is to avoid taking oral steroids that are especially toxic to the liver, such as Anadrol, for extended times. A drug available in Japan called malotilate (Hepation) may reduce liver inflammation. A study showed that using ursodeoxycholic acid, a substance that thins bile secretions and is often used to treat gallstones, relieved the bile backup induced by androgens.7

    Natural means of protecting the liver involve the use of various herbs. One example is Astralgus, which works by increasing glutathione levels in the liver. Glutathione is an antioxidant that also plays a major role in detoxifying substances in the liver, including anabolic steroids. Certain nutrients are known to increase glutathione synthesis in the liver, such as alpha-lipoic acid and N-acetyl cysteine. Milk thistle (silymarin) and a lesser known herbal substance, Picrorhiza kurroa, increase glutathione synthesis and also help regenerate liver cells. Both Astralgus and Picrorhiza kurroa are used in Europe to treat hepatitis and help maintain liver function. Increasing glutathione levels in the liver may be especially important, since one study of isolated liver cells treated with both injectable and oral anabolic steroids showed that the oral drugs depleted liver glutathione levels.8

    Having sufficient amounts of chemicals called methyl groups in the liver also helps keep it healthy. Nutrient sources of methyl groups include lecithin, choline, betaine and S-adenosylmethionine (SAMe). Studies show that SAMe is especially useful for promoting increased bile flow in the liver and may help relieve the bile flow obstruction induced by oral anabolic steroids. SAMe, however, is quite expensive. An alternative method is to increase the intake of nutrients that promote SAMe synthesis in the liver, such as vitamins B12, B6 and folic acid.

    Gamma-linoleic acid (GLA), which is found in evening primrose and borage oils, is often suggested as a way for those using oral anabolic steroids to help protect the liver. Ostensibly, the mechanism involved is a reduction in liver inflammation caused by oral steroids. GLA may help in that respect because its a precursor for anti-inflammatory prostaglandins that may be in short supply when the liver is inflamed.

    Those who are concerned about liver cancer should be conscientious about avoiding contracting all forms of viral hepatitis, which is considered a direct cause of the type of liver cancer thats more fatal than the type usually caused by steroid use. Since such forms of hepatitis are caused by blood contact, be wary of tattooing, body piercing, acupuncture and even sharing razors and toothbrushes (yech!). Sharing needles is a risk factor not only for hepatitis but also for HIV infection.

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    • #47
      @zwaantje
      Winny oral heft een halfwaarde van ong 9 uur
      Winny inject kan je niet clasificeren in een halfwaarde vorm omdat het onge-esterd is
      Maar bevat microcrystallen die aan elkaar gebonden zijn. Zodra ze in het weefsel zijn zullen ze zich langzaam gaan ontbinden.

      Comment


      • #48
        Als het door je lever gaat heb je dan blijvende schade? Of valt dat wel mee?
        Of hersteld de schade?
        Ach ik denk dat overmatig drinken meer schade aanricht aan je lever dan een kuurtje. Als die nu 1x of 2x door me lever gaat zo wat? Of ga je er dood aan?
        een gladde aal blijft altijd glad.

        Comment


        • #49
          Best leuk artikeltje Suikergorilla.

          @ Kees
          Zijn genoeg mensen die erbij zweren dat dianaboll minder slecht is voor je lever dan alcohol, dus of je er aan doodgaat... Denk het niet. Schade herstelt inderdaad (tenzij de schade onherstelbaar is, maar dan moet je wel echt je best doen), en je kunt het herstel bevorderen door bijvoorbeeld mariadistel te gebruiken.
          "Een zoektocht naar kennis moet los staan van het moreel van goed of kwaad, anders is die toch gedoemd niet volledig te zijn." - Genjuro

          sigpic

          "Rock is overpowered. Paper is fine" -Scissors-

          Comment


          • #50
            Ik geloof niet zo in die mariadistel . En om je lever echte schade te geven door gebruik van doping of alcohol moet je idd heel erg je best doen.
            Die 2 keer per jaar dat je een kuur doet , lijkt me dat het geen schade kan geven aan je lever. Tenzij je echt asosiaal bezig bent met orale anabolen dus veel te hoog en telang neemt. Als men gewoon een kuurtje neemt lijkt me mariadistel zelfs overdreven om die erbij te nemen. Ik denk dat het geen waarde geeft aan het zeer geringe of geen schade " die dat geeft aan je lever.
            een gladde aal blijft altijd glad.

            Comment


            • #51
              je lever is het lever(n)de voorbeeld van een zichzelf genezend /herstellend orgaan. maar het heb ook geen zenuwen. dus alstie vrot gaat, voel je het niet. en voel je het wel, dan ben je te laat.
              een dag niet geleefd..... dan ben je dood

              Comment


              • #52
                Vraagje, hoef je hier tenminste geen nieuwe topic voor te openen, en al helemaal aangezien de ts al weet wat die wilt doen.

                Geeft winny oral qua droogheid (harder staan) hetzelfde resultaat als inject?
                Btw, voor een eerste kuur zou je er zo'n 4kg op kunnen pakken (massa) en houden is mij verteld.

                Comment


                • #53
                  yep nexie..oral of inject same results
                  maar dan komt het lever verhaal weer van toepassing
                  zover ik het weet wordt je idd harder en voller ermee

                  en ik zie het nut niet van winstrol als eerste kuur (tenzei je nog wat ander evoor neemt) niet

                  @hele topic
                  Wat is het nu nou precies, gaat een oral 2x langs de lever. Uit het artikel lijkt het me duidelijk van wel.
                  Last edited by sakurakilla; 08-09-2008, 22:59.

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Een oral gaat zeker 2x langs de lever. Denk nog wel vaker ook.
                    "Een zoektocht naar kennis moet los staan van het moreel van goed of kwaad, anders is die toch gedoemd niet volledig te zijn." - Genjuro

                    sigpic

                    "Rock is overpowered. Paper is fine" -Scissors-

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Originally posted by GeneralIx View Post
                      Een oral gaat zeker 2x langs de lever. Denk nog wel vaker ook.
                      yeaah Mr Ix,
                      dan ben ik blij dat we hierbij op 1 lijn staan

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Denk dat Atta's reactie sarcastish was bedoeld suikergorilla.

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Originally posted by GeneralIx View Post
                          Een oral gaat zeker 2x langs de lever. Denk nog wel vaker ook.
                          maar niet vaker erdoorheen.
                          een dag niet geleefd..... dan ben je dood

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Originally posted by Nex- View Post
                            Denk dat Atta's reactie sarcastish was bedoeld suikergorilla.
                            of het wel of niet sarcastisch is denk wel dat atta weet dat een oral 2x langs de lever gaat

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              bemiddeling...

                              Ik zit vol ongeloof te kijken hoe de discussie weer begint op te laaien haha......

                              2x of 1x langs de lever............

                              Hmmmm,

                              2x

                              of

                              1x

                              ach ja het gaat in ieder geval langs de lever daar zijn we over uit haha.
                              P.s. Denk dat Atta's reactie sarcastish was bedoeld suikergorilla. ( moest er wel ff om lachen )hoe verzint ie ut he...

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Met mijn reactie zeg ik dus inderdaad dat een oral gegarandeerd 2x langs de lever komt, en nog wel een paar keer meer. En met langs de lever gaan, bedoel ik dat de lever probeert het goedje te filteren, dank voor de nuance Bruce.
                                "Een zoektocht naar kennis moet los staan van het moreel van goed of kwaad, anders is die toch gedoemd niet volledig te zijn." - Genjuro

                                sigpic

                                "Rock is overpowered. Paper is fine" -Scissors-

                                Comment

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